Kristi Leigh examines the real fights inside the MAHA movement, why some of the people who promised to fix health care are now being accused of capturing it, and what happens when the grassroots starts asking harder questions. She is joined by Dr. Mary Talley Bowden, a board-certified physician, lawyer, allergist, and sleep medicine specialist in Houston who completed her residency at Stanford, founded Americans for Health Freedom, sued the FDA for spreading misinformation and won, and authored Dangerous Misinformation: The Virus, The Treatments, and the Lies.
The conversation begins with Calley Means and his appearance on Joe Rogan, where he alleged that the MAHA agenda was slowed or blocked from inside the White House, pointing to Chief of Staff Susie Wiles, describing pesticide reform as treated like a national security issue, and claiming corporate and lobbying influence got in the way. Dr. Bowden calls Means a fake MAHA grifter and says the interview made Trump and Kennedy look like weak victims. She explains that Means has been on her radar since he parachuted into the movement in 2024, that he will not come out and say anything about the COVID shots, and that she does not believe anything coming out of his mouth.
She then walks through the shift she has watched. Kennedy rose to power on the heels of the pandemic, publishing The Real Anthony Fauci at the worst point of it, while she and other doctors were receiving notices from their medical boards. Since he became HHS secretary, she says, the mRNA platform has expanded, and he does not even speak about it. She argues he could end the PREP Act or pull the mRNA shots with a stroke of a pen, discusses her phone call with him about ivermectin and mRNA, the DNA contamination studies the FDA did not independently confirm, and her theory that he is worried about losing power and staying loyal to the autism-focused base rather than addressing the mRNA emergency.
The second half turns to her two-part series on what she calls the MAHA empire, the takeover of the campaign by American Values PAC, the sixteen trademarks and dozen entities around the MAHA name, the state bills they back and the ones they steer clear of, and her claim that a major MAHA donor is a kratom distributor. She discusses Amaryllis Fox Kennedy’s role at Ballard, Stephanie Spear, Nicole Shanahan being pushed out, the disempowerment of physicians and the shift toward AI-driven medicine, and why she believes health care helped turn Texas blue. She closes on the cases that could get around the PREP Act, removing vaccine manufacturer liability, the mRNA flu shot for ages 50 and older, and why she will never get another flu shot.
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